West Virginia needs healthcare reform

Forum in Clarksburg (0.00 / 0)

An informative panel discussion called "Why Reform Health Care?" will

be held at 7:00pm on Thursday September 17, 2009 at Nutter Fort Elementary

School Cafeteria.

   The panel members will include Perry Bryant, Executive Director of

West Virginians for Affordable Health Care, State Senator Jeff Kessler (D.

Marshall), Joe Powell, President Emeritus WV AFL-CIO, Tammy Phillips,

Methdist Minister from Wallace, and Rick Eddy, President UMW Local from

Fairmont.

   This event is being sponsored by North Central WV Democracy for America

with assistance from WV Citizens Action Group, Harrison County Democrats,

and Organizing for America.

   Following remarks from panel members, written questions from the audience

will be commented upon by panel members.

   This event is a part of a continuing effort on the part of the sponsors to

provide the public with actual and correct information about the movement to

reform health care and the reasons why reform is needed by our country and

West Virginia in particular.

   The event is open to the public and will conclude at 8:30pm.

Contact:
Jerry McKeen
North Central WV DFA
304-933-4424

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 13:15:46 PM UTC

nonsense (0.00 / 1)

1 health insurance is not a right
2. 82 percent of americans have insurance
3. the remaining 18 percent either voluntarily choose not to have it or have access to medical care thru other means (funny how the bacus bill intends to fine folks for not having insurance, if there such a clamoring out the for it why do we have to foce folks to get it by fining them)
4. the government cant responsibly run medicare, medicaid, social security cash for clunkers etc, so excuse me if i am a bit skeptical of the promises of decreased premiums and no drop in care
5. forcing insurance companies to cover preexising conditions, remove lifetime caps etc will only drive up my premiums
6. while with its problems i refuse to concede that americas health care system is broke, its expensive yes but its the best in the world.
7. health insurance is not a right

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by: stevewvu @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 14:21:13 PM UTC

we're #1, we're #1 (0.00 / 0)

Let's start with the mostly easily disproven of your assertions (as opposed to misguided opinions).

By what measure is "americas health care system [broke] the best in the world" ?

Infant mortality rates? Life expectancy? Percent of population covered? Average customer satisfaction? Or, do you have some sort of efficiency measure in mind?

Really, I can't wait to hear your answer on this one.

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by: Clem Guttata @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 15:16:43 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Flag lapel pins (4.00 / 2)

Our healthcare wears flag lapel pins. That makes it No. 1.


When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 15:36:55 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

steve (4.00 / 1)

In the words of you, blah, blah, blah. ;)

1 and 7

The U.S. Constitution... "...To provide for the general welfare..."

Roads aren't a right. Do you complain about traveling on them too? Fire protection isn't a right either? Do you complain when the fire trucks show up to help you or your neighbor in an emergency? (Even the volunteer companies receive federal and state grants.) No where in the Constitution is there a right to have the FBI. Are you for the abolishment of the FBI?

2 82 percent of Americans with insurance are seeing their premiums rise at much faster rates than their incomes while at the same time we end up paying more out of pocket and can have insurance company bureaucratics cancel our policies or make decisions instead of our doctors about our healthcare. In no other - repeat - in no other nation in the industrialized world can someone be forced into bankruptcy because of medical bills. The leading cause of bankruptcy in this country is medical bills and the vast majority of those people were middleclass and with insurance. It could even happen to you.

3 The Baucus plan sucks. On that we agree. Everything else in your 3 isn't worth responding to.

4 It's funny how you say the govt. can't responsibly run those programs which are very popular with people. The best was listening to rightwingers telling people for the govt. to keep out of their Medicare.

5 A public option providing competition will drive down your premiums. But unintentionally you make a great argument with your 5 on why we should have national health care like Canada, Britain, Japan, etc.

6 If it's the best in the world, why are we 38th in life expectancy and among the highest in infant mortality rates?

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 15:22:58 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

i am (0.00 / 1)

willing to pay my existing premiums, even if they increase, to keep the coverage i have now and keep the government out of my health treatment...the public option, the absurd requirement that insurance companies cover everybody even with preexisting condition and removing lifetime caps are nothing more than a way to price the insurance companies out of the market and force everybody in the end to rely on the government plan...and in my view the "general welfare" language does not mean cradle to grave health insurance...we are thirty eighth in life expectancy and high in infant mortality rate because the entitlement society we've created thus far has turned us from the baddest ass go getters in the world who work and play hard into soft drinking, chip eating, cigarette smoking lazy fat asses...even the best health care in the world cant help those who eat, smoke and drink to excess... obesity is the biggest health problem in america today...i dont need the government to take care of my health issues...i can handle that myself...and while doing that i dont want to take care of yours too....

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by: stevewvu @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 18:21:27 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Thank you Rush, Glen and all the others (4.00 / 1)

that are giving you the jingoistic language you are spouting. By the way your own words shoot down the argument you are trying to make...

i dont need the government to take care of my health issues...i can handle that myself...and while doing that i dont want to take care of yours too....

That may be true until you have a pre-existing condition, a serious illness, or lose your gainful means of employment.  Your family and yourself at that point will have the same choice so many others have today of bankruptcy, loss of a home, or even worse the loss of a family member. 

Hey man the system is already causing you to pay for others as we see the decline of a middle class, the loss of jobs to other nations, and folks having to go to the emergency room just to see a doctor. 

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by: wvblueguy @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 18:40:30 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

and (0.00 / 0)

if that happens it happens...i have disability insurance but i am not adverse to filing bankruptcy if i had to...i'd rather lose it all and have to start over than to ask for a hand out from the government..why, because i believe its up to me not the goverment to handle those problems...and for you to handle yours...and i'd rather lose my life than rely on the government to save it, because they cant...and dont give me that rush /glenn crap...i have never listened to glenn beck, hell i didnt know who he was till a couple months ago...and rush, while i have heard him before i am not one of his following...in fact i'd bet you know more of his stances on the issues than i...the american health care system is not broken but jay and nancy and barney keep telling you it is so they can garner control of a bigger piece of your life...and the more they say it the more people start to believe it...its now bordering on nonsense.......

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by: stevewvu @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 18:58:22 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

steve (0.00 / 0)

I'm sorry you feel that way. I'm sure the people who care for you offline and those of us here would rather you be saved by a govt. plan than to die like 22,000 Americans each year because you didn't have insurance to pay for your care.

By your reasoning, if you can't pull yourself out of a fire, you'd rather die in the blaze than to have a govt. paid firefighter save you. That's not rational thinking, my friend.

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 19:06:15 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

well where i live (0.00 / 0)

i'd be saved by a volunteer firefighter ;)

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by: stevewvu @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 19:43:54 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

steve (0.00 / 0)

In between the screams for help, don't forget to ask the firefighter if the fire engine was paid for by a state or federal grant. :)

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 19:52:34 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

you want me to add up how many (4.00 / 2)

for the "volunteer" fire department have been granted in the last five years here?

Let's take up a collection and buy that series of books my kids have "The Way Things Work".

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance

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by: CA Berkeley WV @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 20:57:25 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

stevewvu, the snack police returns, just forget about Medical Loss Ratio and recission (4.00 / 2)

how does Mayo get such good results? how does Cleveland get such good results?

Having the profit motive on Wall Street determine if I get health care through the insurance model is caving into monopoly and a cartel of greed based on stock price. That is a nutty way to run a railroad no matter how many Cheetos I eat.

F'u about "it's all your fault" mentality. Is the person with bladder cancer from industrial pollution just not blessed by the Invisible Pink Unicorn in your good book? You are so forgiving of the coal industry pollution and hard on people who eat the food, that gets big fat subsidies from the Ag bill to the tune of $22 billion and is therefore cheap, for eating the least expensive food at the store. Corn Fed Nation.

I revert to your form: STOP BITCHING ABOUT FAT PEOPLE, EMPTY YOUR WALLET, AND START A FARMERS MARKET AND OFFER FRESH FRUITS AND VEGETABLES BELOW THE PRICE AT THE LOCAL MARKET.

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance

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by: CA Berkeley WV @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 18:52:48 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

CA (0.00 / 0)

Aren't you the one who gets on me for mixing it up too rough? ;)

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 19:07:35 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

it was suggested to Clem that he stop (4.00 / 1)

asking for a replacement for coal and build his own wind farm. I am sitting here listening to the oversight hearing. Yesterday it was doctors and Wendel Potter. Today it is the health care insurance representatives. There is a whole new industry to build the data to deny claims.

Some disease is from our own bad habits, and some is related to stress. Stress from wondering if your kid can get a job. Stress from the blasting over in the next hollow. Stress from worrying hat the payments on the new frigidaire are going up just because they can because contracts don't matter. Stress from competing with coal trucks on the road. The idea that we are each an island unto our own, that there is no collective that has driven us to police protection, fire protection, to not extend it to health protection hurts. Mean people suck.

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance

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by: CA Berkeley WV @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 20:51:07 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

you (0.00 / 0)

shouldnt eat cheetos, they are gross...and i agree on the corn subsidies...get rid of them and spend the money on a tax break for me...

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by: stevewvu @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 19:09:14 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

i should have expected that (4.00 / 1)

me
me
me

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance

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by: CA Berkeley WV @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 20:52:22 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

steve (4.00 / 1)

Steve, I know we don't agree on many things regarding politics, but even you have to admit your comment makes no sense. I think your anger overrode your logic.

Entitlements in other countries with much better entitlements keep their people healthier, but entitlements in this country with much fewer entitlements make people fat and lazy and unhealthier? By your logic, the entitlement systems in the other countries would make their residents even unhealthier.

You can do better than that.

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 18:58:22 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

i amend in part (0.00 / 0)

my comment as certainly there are other factors beyond entitlement mentality which go into the obesity problem in this country...but make no mistake about it, obesity, something within the individual control of each of us, is the leading cause of health problems in this country...add in smoking and drinking to the mix and the great majority of health issues in this country are self inflicted...imagine how much health care costs would go down if those issues were addresssed...but people dont want to do or hear anything about it...yet they want the government to take care of them....if said it before, god helps those who help themselves...they want to continue to do the wrong thing expecting someone else to take care of them..

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by: stevewvu @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 19:39:53 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

i repeat my self (4.00 / 1)

start a co-op and make sure all those fat people have the choice of fresh vegetables and fruits at the same cost as soda pop and chips. a little bit of wine is not the problem, i mean what was the first public miracle of that jeebus dude anyway? and beer is so-oo ancient we have grown up with it as a species.

you really believe that g-d comes down and individually selects people for blessings based on hard work for self? that is the basis on eternal life to you? geez, i thought it was faith alone and works in the dark for others, the 11th commandment, to love your neighbor as yourself. you old testament or new testament?

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance

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by: CA Berkeley WV @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 21:05:53 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

but health care is a human right (4.00 / 1)

and if you insist on delivering it in the most expensive way with the 37th worst results, by all means, keep your head in the sand and keep shelling out your money to the death by spreadsheet for profit system. you are paying for whatever percentage you say have no insurance for whatever reason.

AND THE BAUCUS PLAN SUCKS, so don't hold it up as anything.

i hereby rescind my contribution for your portion of the state police protection you enjoy, since government can't do anything right.

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance

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by: CA Berkeley WV @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 15:42:29 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Health care is a right... (4.00 / 3)

in virtually every country of substance in the world.  We are not number one in health care, and haven't been for years.  General Motors and other major manufacturing companies can't build cars in the United States as cheaply as they can in Canada right across the border from Detroit because of the high cost of health care.

I have worked for the same group of companies for over 20 years, and have watched as ownership has to renegotiate or find a new provider every year because the previous years experience rating caused huge increases.  It is amazing that anyone who works today can even afford to buy insurance from the providers contracted by their employers. Where I work folks are looking at deductibles as high as $5,000 or more, serious restrictions on pre-existing conditions, impossible in network physicians that have negotiated a deal with the provider (meaning you can't pick your own doctor), and limitations on lifetime amounts that can be paid out for each member of a family. Once all those conditions are in place the employee is looking at $800 or more per month just for their share of premium costs.

If there is anyone that is deliriously happy with their present insurance program then they are likely a government employee, a union employee, in the VA system or on medicare with a supplemental program.  I can assure you that an employee working for typical middle class wages must make a very difficult decision as to whether they will sign on to their company's health insurance program. By the way if you are someone coming out of the military or someone who didn't sign up for the VA program prior to Iraq, and you make $32,000 a year or more you cannot get VA coverage.

I don't have any idea what kind of insurance folks are talking about that 82% of our population has, but I can assure you that here in southern West Virginia you are just plain lucky if you even have the chance to buy insurance through your employer.

We do live in a great country, and I have served our country proudly.  I will continue to sing the praises of the lifestyle I have today.  The people of our country whether they are rich, poor, unemployed, overweight, gay, straight, atheist, christian, jewish, moslem, young, old, married or single deserve what folks in 36 other countries ranked higher than our nation in health care have. Health is a right and should be affordable.  Just ask the doctors in the AMA that support the public option.  The United States cannot compete in a world economy where other nations make sure that there citizens can get well and that they don't have to worry about the wellness of their families.

I'm sick and tired of hearing about not being able to afford the cost. We can't afford it now. We as a nation must carry the burden of health care or we will decline as a world power.

Twenty years ago we did have programs through employers that were affordable for young working families.  Today we just don't.  Without a program that has a strong public option our country is doomed to eventually becoming an also ran on the world stage.  

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by: wvblueguy @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 18:11:09 PM UTC

Well said (4.00 / 1)

We need your voice here more often.

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

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by: Carnacki @ Thu Sep 17, 2009 at 18:19:17 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Stevewvu follows The Blankenship Bankruptcy model (0.00 / 0)

The ultimate example of "Atlas Shrugged"/ Objectivist - style avarice-driven corporate strategy was revealed in the very reason why Don Blankenship bankrupted the highly productive and  vibrant Cannelton and Starfire mines.

With his above post stevewvu also inadvertently revealed why he really bans his employees from accessing the internet.  He obviously doesn't want them to find out that he actually plans to bankrupt his business.

When you think about it, his position of being adamantly opposed to any possibility of a government sponsored public option goes beyond merely saving his company a lot of money. Lowering premiums and/ or granting tax rebates for covering employees doesn't interest him one bit. And we all know that stevewvu has demonstrated in his many past comments that he really doesn't give a rat's hind leg about the constitution, except to whatever extent it might be implemented to shore up his personal opinion.

No, what it really comes down to is that stevewvu knows that many, if not most, of his employees put up with him ONLY because of the company group plan benefits. He realizes that a strong public option would essentially grant his employees the ability to break free from him before he's done flogging the last drop of sweat from them.

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by: One Citizen @ Fri Sep 18, 2009 at 10:04:54 AM UTC

How many times have I heard that one? (4.00 / 2)

Stevewvu moans

the government cant responsibly run medicare, medicaid, social security cash for clunkers etc, so excuse me if i am a bit skeptical of the promises of decreased premiums and no drop in care

After having voted for George Bush, stevewvu's got a lot of nerve posting that "the government" can't run those programs. With the exception of the "cash for clunkers" (which was very successful because Bush didn't have a thing to do with it other than collapsing the economy) every single one suffered from the ravages of mismanagement, thanks to ol' steve's vote!  Notice that he left out the Veteran's Administration, where Bush and his Republican cohort actually was caught blowing it big time.

And just think where social security would be, had Bush been allowed to fulfill his dream to privatize it just before the market crash.

Do I even need to mention Bush's role in the Medicare $80 Billion dollar sellout? And why not slash Medicaid just to secure those precious tax cuts for the wealthy as Bush proposed?

Stevewvu above claims that he'd rather die than accept a government handout.

Hey steve, show us that not just blowing smoke and sign the pledge to reject Medicare now and forever.

note:

The self-employed and small businesses with fewer than 25 workers constitute only about 30% of all workers, but they represent almost half of uninsured workers, or close to 17 million people. These small businesses have the highest rate of uninsurance and constitute the largest percentage of uninsured workers. If you include the spouse and dependents for this group, a significant number of the uninsured are workers or dependents of workers in small businesses. source

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by: One Citizen @ Fri Sep 18, 2009 at 13:21:34 PM UTC