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Imported bottled water drinking arugula munching libs helping Massey's candidate pull a trifecta

by: IndependentThinker

Sat Sep 18, 2010 at 12:53:03 PM EDT


SHOCKER:

WVABLUE ADVOCATES FOR MANCHIN.

IndependentThinker :: Imported bottled water drinking arugula munching libs helping Massey's candidate pull a trifecta
Isn't the Governor polling at somewhere around seventy percent higher than Raese even without all the sucking up in what's supposed to be a freaking progressive web site?

Criminy, what's there to be so scared about when Massey's already covering his back by blanketing the state with those slick ads about how wonderfully blessed it is to be a surface miner?

In the meantime, the Sierra Club has refused to endorse the one candidate that stands against strip mining and for responsible deep mining of coal, just like THEY do only because he has no corporate backers. Which I find really, really curious. Add to that the fact that the two major trade unions won't support Jesse Johnson either, even though he actually earned his trade union card and stands for jobs by the very act of advocating deep mining an eliminating strip mining.

Don't forget that prior to widespread surface mining there were around 200,000 union mine workers in West Virginia, and our economy was rockin'!

Speaking of which, the WV Chamber of Commerce endorsed Manchin although during the period of his administration, more small businesses have been chased out of here or gone belly-up than in any other state!

All this means that Mojo has magically somehow pulled off what's known in certain circles as a political trifecta after the death of our beloved Senator Byrd. Who believed, like Jesse Johnson does, that the U.S. Constitution is every American citizen's owner's manual.

Just keep shouting about how great Manchin is, WVA BLUE, and you'll either completely destroy the Democratic party in WV, or at least chase off all of the Progressives. Which is exactly what Manchin set out to do back when he fired up that Democrats for Underwood deal after Charlott Pritt and the Democratic Wing of the party beat him in their primary.

Quick, somebody get me barf bag. I'm not sure whether I'm starting to retch over Mojo's forced bottled water deal all across southern West Virginia, or if it's because of all that "clean" coal dust that's been blown up everyone's ass on his behalf in here lately.
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Imported bottled water drinking arugula munching libs helping Massey's candidate pull a trifecta | 21 comments
Thank you! (4.00 / 1)
You are my media hero!
Barf Bags? (1.00 / 1)
I know where you can get some 'barf bags', Jesse Johnson has a boat load of them to hand out!
SICK enough yet of having only a 2 Corporate Political Party power system that is robbing you, your children and grandchildren of their future?

. . .Ignoring the Constitution,Wall Street Bailouts,Wars for profit, Prisons for profit,Selling your private banking & medical information, Health Care sellout to Pharmaceutical and Insurance Lobbies, Private Corporate Armies, Corporate Personhood, Domestic Spying, Privatization and poisoning our water sources,Corporate Welfare... Your answer...
Jesse Johnson, Mountain Party
For WV US Senate

Invoking Senator Byrd, eh? That's pretty shameless (4.00 / 1)
Are you trying to imply that Byrd would back Johnson? If that's the case, then why did Johnson devote one of his 5 failed candidacies to running against the senator in 2006?

[ Parent ]
West Virginia Blue (4.00 / 1)
West Virginia Blue has consistently over the years written about the evils of mountaintop removal and hasn't just jumped on it for one election cycle like some of you just jumping on the band wagon now before the election.

This site has consistently been critical of Democrats and Republicans who support mountaintop removal and has worked to move the party on the issue as opposed to those who would rather throw their vote away.

There's a reason the Sierra Club hasn't endorsed the Mountain Party candidate.

There's a reason labor hasn't supported the Mountain Party candidate.

I guess environmental groups and labor are out to destroy the Democratic Party in the state just like West Virginia Blue.

Where has the Mountain Party been in terms of building up progressives in the state? The only time we hear from the Mountain Party is right before an election. In between then, who is sounding the alarm bells on mountaintop removal and working on progressive causes? That's right, West Virginia Blue. Do a search on mountaintop removal

So keep in mind when you're taking your shots at this site that it is West Virginia Blue. This site is not only for progressives but for Democrats.

Go to the Mountain Party's blog to tout your supposed interest in progressive causes. Oh that's right, no one bothered to build a netroot's site for the Mountain Party. The Mountain Party people haven't invested any time or energy online in reaching out and educating people.

Maybe the reason the Mountain Party candidate has not been endorsed by the AFL-CIO and the Sierra Club and other progressive organizations is because  Mountain Party people seem to spend tearing down potential allies than actually reaching out to build coalitions.



When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

Jesse4ussenate (0.00 / 0)
Thank you so much for your perspective and support of Jesse!!

The U.S. Constitution really should be every citizen's owner's manual. The media has been slighting Jesse (to say the least) acting as if it's not "We the People" but "We the Money" with Manchin and Raese spending their way through it all.  And the mud slinging going on between Manchin and Raese...and Jesse just siticking to the issues, he is not wasting energy on the negative just what will solve the problems that we need addressed. He is standing up for our State, our Country. Money can come and go, but you cannot match his energy and passion.

nbl13 (4.00 / 1)
Too bad his supporters like the author of this diary doesn't stick to the issues like Jesse.

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.
[ Parent ]
Mountain Party (4.00 / 2)
This is a blog for Democrats.
No one from this site has harrassed any of the Mountain Party people for posting here. No one has prevented any Mountain Party people from posting here.

My view is there are areas where Mountain Party supporters and progressive Democrats can work together and since none of you have taken the trouble to build an online community for the Mountain Party, you're welcome to post here.

However, that welcome is conditional. This post is insulting not only to liberals, but to people who could form coalitions with you.

If in the wildest world Jesse was elected, who would he caucus with in the Senate? Much like Bernie Sanders, he would caucus with the Democrats. Would you then toss him aside for selling out by working with Democrats? Or would you be content with working within the system that exists?

As administrator, I would not let Republicans come to this site and promote their candidates and tear down the Democrats. The diaries would be deleted and the diarists banned on many Democratic sites like DailyKos.

Mountain Party people are free to post diaries here and comment all they wish promoting Jesse and promoting progressive policies.

But if I see another diary this trollish again, that invitation will be revoked and I'll treat the diaries and diarists no differently than I would if they were Republican. It's your choice whether you find a home here or not.  

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

counter-productive (4.00 / 1)
If this diary is trying to win over liberals or progressives to vote for Jesse Johnson, it is completely counter-productive. Insulting people is not the way to gain their support.

Tell me why I should support the Jesse Party. Tell me what seat he is running for that he most wants to win.

I still don't get what he hopes to accomplish by running. Help me understand that, without the insults, please.

Ask Micheal Moore (4.00 / 2)
what he thinks of Ralph Nader now, as opposed to back in 2000.

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance
<sigh> (4.00 / 1)
I understand everyone's objections regarding the Mountain Party. They really do only seem to come out pre-election. But this two-party system doesn't seem to be serving anyone very well these days. Our country is so polarized right now. I am extremely disappointed that I have to choose between Manchin and Raese. Neither one of them represents anything I could even try to call progressive. My county is running two county commissioners, neither of which support zoning. I just wish I could convince those who are disappointed in Obama that it's not entirely his fault that his ideals are failing to pass - it's Congress'.

I am on the brink of voting for Johnson. I'll make my final determination when I see the polls just before election. I just want to somehow register my progressive vote (but I don't want Raese -- he is just too dangerous).


Beauty will save the world

Interesting Post (0.00 / 0)
My distaste for Manchin's right wing turn has been clearly stated in many other posts- some on here and some elsewhere.  I have also stated that I am not about to support the Mountain Party, which I consider to only detract from progressive's attempts to change the WV Democratic Party.  That being said, I am saddened that this poster would be threatened with banishment for merely stating an opinion, even if it is an unpopular opinion with some of the rank and file.  I realize that is the practice over at WVaRed but if I ever feel that is the new policy at Blue I will simply stop coming to the site.  

More to the issue, I question the strategy behind supporting a candidate that has aired an ad actively denouncing the Democratic President on the environment and spending.  A candidate that, instead of using the bully pulpit to lead, has used it to undercut core Democratic and Progressive values up and down the Party's agenda.  This site could, and in my opinion should, be a place where moderate to liberal Democrats use the power of free and compelling speech to leverage Manchin back from his attempts to outflank the silver spoon goon.  Efforts that I think could set the Democratic Party, but more importantly progressive thought, into a death spiral over the next couple decades.  

No election is so important to sacrifice everything to win it.  No politician, especially Manchin, is so essential to progress that all consideration to good policy should be thrown out the door in support of their flawed campaign tactics.

policy (0.00 / 0)
It is extremely rare that anyone (other than obvious spammers) is banned. It is a last resort for repeated  violation of community norms.

No one has been or will be banned for merely stating an opinion.

Comments may be hidden through community moderation for issues like: being offensive to others, personally attacking others, constantly off-topic with intent to derail conversations (trolling), excessive use of foul language, or violation of copyright/other legal issues.

If someone keeps doing these things over and over, that's what can lead to account being banned, not their views on specific topics.

[ Parent ]
time to circle the wagons (0.00 / 0)
Jeremiah -- If you have any great ideas on how to "leverage Manchin back from his attempts to outflank the silver spoon goon," by all means do share.

Personally, I think that primaries are the time to fight policy battles inside the party. Come general election time, I'm prepared to circle the wagons and get behind our candidates.

Once the election is won, I'll be all over Sen. Manchin again to lobby for more progressive policies. He'll be starting from a point much closer to the center than a Sen. Raese would.

[ Parent ]
WVaBlue and Jeremiah (4.00 / 1)
I'd point out we've been doing exactly what Jeremiah says we should be doing.

Even our most recent posts on Manchin on tax cuts and health reform have pointed out better ways to campaign on the issues and I at least have pointed out he needs to energize the Democratic base instead of appealing to Republicans who aren't going to vote for him anyway.


When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

[ Parent ]
without consequences there is no leverage (0.00 / 0)
My humble and unpopular opinion is that unless Dems are willing to truly not vote for Manchin then he will (and has)continue to go further to the right.  It is my opinion that the very fabric of the WV Democratic Party is at stake.  If politico Dems see they can win by undercutting the base then they will do so in every election in an attempt to win over on the fence conservatives.

Don't get me wrong, Raese is horrible.  However, I am not willing to cede the war so Manchin can win this one battle.  

[ Parent ]
Jeremiah (4.00 / 1)
I was fine with Mountain Party people using this as a forum since the Mountain Party only exists right before elections and NONE of them had bothered to build up their netroots or do any online outreach or education of progressive issues. Even their web site's candidate section still lists the 2008 race.

But when they went from promoting the Jesse Party candidate to attacking people on the site, including one for not sharing their same level of enthusiasm for their candidate, then they were no longer welcome.

As should be obvious, no one from the site complained or threatened bannings in their other diaries so it is offensive to me that you would suggestion someone was banned for stating their opinions.  

When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

[ Parent ]
no offense intended (0.00 / 0)
I didn't suggest someone had been banned.  

I said, "I am saddened that this poster would be threatened with banishment for merely stating an opinion, even if it is an unpopular opinion with some of the rank and file."

This was in response to this, "You're welcome to post here...
However, that welcome is conditional...As administrator, I would not let Republicans come to this site and promote their candidates and tear down the Democrats. The diaries would be deleted and the diarists banned on many Democratic sites like DailyKos...But if I see another diary this trollish again, that invitation will be revoked and I'll treat the diaries and diarists no differently than I would if they were Republican."

We are on the same team so I don't want to belabor this.  However, the freedom to express ideas, especially unpopular ideas, is a crucial factor in the equation of change- either through the merit of the idea or the value of the response opposing it.  

[ Parent ]
sockpuppets are generally frowned upon too (4.00 / 2)
etiquette on blogs is really no different than personal, face to face common decency. Insults are not welcome. You know we belong to no organized party. Differing opinions are alwasy going to be here.

I really thought the dogs and hooded prisoners, ala torture approved under Bush, in was unnecessarily inflammatory. Either you have a solid policy position to defend, or not.

As as I have gently stated over and over, don't come into our house, take a crap in the corner, and expected to be invited to the next dinner party. And the inability to fight like hell up to primary night, and then work like hell together to keep the other side from winning is very short sighted. You really think that letting the other guy win is going to teach anyone a lesson about being more progressive?  

NFTT: Support My Team or I Will Dance

[ Parent ]
Lessons (0.00 / 0)
As perhaps the last true bastion of the Southern Democrats, West Virginia progressives have for too long accepted the "political reality" of allowing Democratic leaders undercut core Democratic positions.  There is nothing gained by perpetuating a system that drives not progress, but the status quo of poverty, poor health, poor education, social stagnation, and environmental devastation.  I play ball most of the time because of all the very true statements that the WV GOP is batsh*t crazy, Raese being batsh*t craziest.  However, Manchin has made a mockery of Democratic positions on tax cuts for the rich, MTR and the environment generally, health reform, social issues, etc.  I ask the question, are we being good Dems by supporting him anyway or are we capitulating to a candidate that may be irreparably damaging the Democratic Party's message in WV to the point that it might not ever be able to recover.

I believe we are experiencing a realignment in West Virginia politics (see recent presidential elections) that will ultimately result in politicos and conservative Dems  recognizing that the Democratic label has been damaged to the point that they actually benefit by running as Republicans.  That leaves the Democratic Party with a more progressive group but one that has had its message destroyed by years of neglect and right wing capitulation.  

We are killing the longterm viability of the party.  Just my humble opinion,

[ Parent ]
Jeremiah (0.00 / 0)
BTW, nice strawman with your question "I ask the question, are we being good Dems by supporting him anyway or are we capitulating to a candidate that may be irreparably damaging the Democratic Party's message in WV to the point that it might not ever be able to recover." I could play that game too. "I ask the question, are we being good Dems by supporting Manchin or should we let the Republican candidate who wants to fuck over the middleclass and poor at every opportunity help destroy the Democratic Party to the point it might not ever be able to recover." What a fun game you started.

Have you seen any environmental, labor or other progressive organizations of note back Jesse? Of course not. They don't like Manchin either, but they can count.

Manchin is being killed now in the polls because he was supportive of Obama in the 2008 election. Bailing on him now is not only going to hurt Democrats in West Virginia but across the nation.

Go read Crashing the Gates. Progressives need to get active with the county Democratic organizations and work to promote progressive candidates from the inside and organize their friends to do the same. The WV Young Democrats were making good strides on MTR. On the other hand the Mountain Party disappears in between elections and does nothing but siphon off a few progressives who might feel better and more pure by taking an easy route but are not being productive.

The lesson Democrats will take from this election if Manchin loses is to run further to the right. The Republicans have framed this race about progress. We go into it, to paraphrase Don Rumsfeld, with the candidate we have and not the candidate we want, but that's the issue.

Unlike those who show up occasional, I'll keep hammering Manchin and other Democrats on the need to move forward with progress on the environment and other issues. But I'm not going to bail when the going gets tough either.



When a man embarks upon a crime, he is morally guilty of any other crime which may spring from it. Sherlock Holmes.

[ Parent ]
Who is voting for Johnson? (4.00 / 1)
I don't know what makes you think I would ever back Jesse Johnson.  I absolutely do not support his campaign nor would I ever vote for him.  I think the energy wasted by progressives on Mountain Party/ Green Party activities divides and conquerors progressives in the state.  The Mountain Party is ineffective and will not be the reason Manchin loses.  Manchin will have lost this, if he does, in the number of Democrats who said to hell with it and stayed home or wrote in Donald Duck on their ballot.

I was down at party HQ volunteering at least two to three times a week for Obama.  Let's be real- Manchin's support of Obama was soft at best.  The only thing Manchin ever really talks about with any zest is coal and we all know how Manchin has positioned himself against Obama on that.

Manchin has never tried to go out and defend the President's policies, even those Obama positions that should appeal to moderates/conservatives.  That is why he is losing. Folks like Manchin allowed the President to become so unpopular in the state, through his lack of educating the public, that once Raese started spending his family's fortune linking the two, Manchin was overcome by the onslaught.  He thought his MoJo would carry him through and he was wrong.  

I voted for Hechler in the primary and had every intention of voting for Manchin in the general.  I blogged why Dems should fall in line using your same logic about Raese.  I was going to hold my nose as long as he didn't go off the farm.  I defended Manchin's policies that I agreed with- cutting the food tax, corporate net income tax, etc.  Then Manchin goes out and makes the statement about the tax cuts for the rich, undercuts the Party on health care (a law that is admittedly flawed), has the ad about Obama's spending, and now is SUING Obama to defend MTR. It is not over either.  I bet Manchin goes to depths that will make even your moderate Dem cringe in trying to position himself against Obama.

Manchin left me, not me him.    I am not some flash pan liberal- not even sure I am a liberal.  I will fight for the Democratic Party over the long haul but I am not going to just fall in line for someone  that is willing to do long term damage to almost every position that I feel strongly about.  As far as Party loyalty, Manchin surely showed that with his Democrats for Underwood work, no?  

As far as the lesson gleaned from this possible defeat, I disagree about the narrative.  The VAST majority of viable Dems that lose nationally will be conservative Dems.  Their failure to educate their constituents about the merits of Obamas policies will be their undoing.  I hope we agree that this MUST be the narrative in WV as well.  We might as well go ahead and start writing the script.

[ Parent ]
Imported bottled water drinking arugula munching libs helping Massey's candidate pull a trifecta | 21 comments
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